Taiwan Must ‘Step Up’ for Democracy: Interview With Journalist Esther Htusan

Taiwan’s 2019 Oslo Freedom Forum featured dozens of international activists, dissidents and journalists who gathered to promote human rights and democracy. Among them was Esther Htsuan, a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist from Myanmar who was forced to flee the country in 2017 after receiving death threats related to her reporting on the country’s Rohingya crisis.

Ketagalan Media caught up with Esther at the forum, held in Taipei last month, to chat about her experience reporting on modern slavery in the high seas fishing industry, the problems surrounding growing Chinese investment in her home country, and how Taiwan can both engage in the global community and learn from the experiences of its regional neighbors.

Ketagalan Media: Let’s start with some of your previous work, most notably being part of AP’s Pulitzer-winning investigation, Seafood from Slaves, on modern slavery in the Thai fishing industry.

Taiwan, too, has long been connected with large-scale human rights violations in its own fishing industry, but they haven’t received the same amount of global attention as those of Thailand. What needs to change for Taiwan to receive more attention in this aspect, to push for better working conditions? 

Esther Htusan: Well, I think this is telling us journalists to investigate about these kinds of issues that are ongoing, and to actually expose them so that we can hold perpetrators and businesses accountable.

KM: What were your experiences as a reporter observing the scope of modern slavery in the global fishing industry? And what were some of the biggest difficulties in uncovering abuses throughout the seafood supply chain? 

EH: This is one of the most horrific human stories that has been ongoing over the last 200 years, and it has not stopped. It is horrible, but it is still happening in Asia and Southeast Asia, particularly in the fishing business, even after the investigation that we did together back in 2014 and 2015. It raises the question of how much corporate businesses are really respecting human rights when they run the businesses.

It’s very important for societies, as well as journalists and human activists, to really work on making sure that these businesses respect human rights while running their businesses. Unfortunately, the fact that it’s still ongoing makes me feel like I haven’t done enough to really stop these things from happening. 

KM: Taiwan has touted its New Southbound Policy to encourage trade with South and Southeast Asian countries (and to move it away from China). But this policy doesn’t contain a human rights component, and Southeast Asian migrant fishermen, caregivers, and factory workers regularly face work abuse, financial exploitation, and debt bondage through third-party brokerage agencies. 

If Taiwan fails to reform its migrant worker policies, will this end up harming its attempt to cast itself internationally as a protector of democracy? 

EH: I would definitely say yes, because I think businesses should also think in a way that is sustainable for them. What if they’re violating laborers’ and workers’ rights? What if they are not following international and domestic laws that are in place to respect labor rights? Then, at some point, it would come back and haunt you and destroy your business.

So I think it’s very important on the business side to really respect the labor laws, domestically and internationally. If they’re hiring someone from outside of Taiwan or outside of their own country, they have to respect the regional law as well as their own domestic and international laws to ensure that their businesses are sustainable and respectful to human rights and labor rights. 

KM: What does Taiwan have to do to move toward being a leader in protecting the human rights of all the people in the country, including these Southeast Asian migrants?

EH: I think Taiwan and Hong Kong really stand in a unique place that other Asian nations can look up to. The fact that it is able to stand away from the most oppressive regime next door is very respectable.

It’s important for Taiwan to keep going down the same path, to follow the values of human rights and democracy. It would really encourage other Asian nations to follow in their steps, even despite the bigger threats standing right next to you.

Taiwan has a lot of potential to step up instead of stepping down, to continue respecting human rights and upholding democracy.

KM: Shifting gears into Myanmar’s current state, many people in Taiwan, as well as around the world, admired Aung San Suu Kyi when she was an activist. Why do you think she changed, and how do you think things can get better in Myanmar again? 

EH: The thing is, it’s not a question of whether this person has changed or not. What we have to do is look back on what she has done or what she hasn’t done.

When we look over the last three years since her party took office in the Parliament with the majority seats, there could’ve been so many things that are easy, not confronting the military, to actually move the country forward into a democratic society, by abolishing repressive laws. But, her government was completely reluctant to do any of this and that really shows us that she, and her government, were not really willing to change the country into a more democratic society.

We’re talking about facts and data. How many journalists have been arrested? How many people who have criticized the government and as a result been arrested? This data really shows that her government does not particularly respect democratic values or the promises they made to uphold civil society. 

KM: What roles do you think Taiwan’s government or civil society can play in helping with the Rohingya and authoritarian crises in Myanmar? 

EH: As a journalist, I’m not in a position to tell others what they should or should not do, but I think when we look at regions and societies and communities in a geopolitical area. For example, in ASEAN, there are 10 countries and most countries don’t interfere with anyone else’s policies. Of course, it’s a lot about sovereignty, but it’s also very important for regional governments to come together when something is really wrong. You have to come out and say it’s wrong, and remind each other to come back to their democratic values.

I think that’s what Taiwanese government and society groups can do, to encourage people in Myanmar or the government in Myanmar to remember what it was like in the past during the military dictatorship, how much we have overcome, and show us how to actually maintain these democratic values that we have endured so much to have. It’s very important to encourage each other, but I don’t want to say what people should or should not do as a journalist. 

KM: What lessons do you think Myanmar offers to the people of Taiwan? Or to the people of Hong Kong, or China?

EH: The biggest lesson that we all can learn is that we actually endured half a century of military dictatorship, and we have finally come to a sunrise. However, instead of making that sun shine, we actually made it dim. We have come a long way from where we were before, to be able to do what we do and speak what we say today. What happened to Myanmar is that it went backwards, into the situation that we used to endure. We should not want to go back under that military dictatorship that has the power to darken society for a long time. 

KM: What are your feelings on China’s role in “managing” the Rohingya crisis, and what does this tell us about China’s intentions in places like Hong Kong, Xinjiang, and Taiwan? 

EH: As a journalist, it’s not about my opinion, but more about what I’ve observed. I can tell you that when we look at international institutions like the United Nations and the UN Security Council, Russia and China are two of the major veto countries. When the UN [Security Council] talks about the Rohingya crisis, you can always see that China and Russia are protecting the Burmese military and the Myanmar government, despite the atrocities they have committed. It really tells you a lot about where China stands when it comes to human rights issues. 

KM: What are your thoughts on the impact of China’s investment projects in Myanmar? Do you think the local opposition to projects such as the Myitsone Dam will force Beijing to reconsider its Belt and Road strategy in other parts of the world? 

EH: The bigger question is, does China really care about any impact on any of their investments that they’ve done in any country in this region? No, they don’t. It’s the same in Myanmar. Their investments have caused internal conflicts in the region.

For example, when we look at Chinese investment in Myanmar, most of their investments, wherever they are, have conflict. Not only are they investing in unsustainable development, or investments that don’t benefit the local people or respect anything. They just invest, but they don’t care about any other impact that they’ve caused to a community.

Myitsone Dam is particularly one of the biggest reasons that caused the civil war in Kachin state in the North. China isn’t only investing in that area; there are so many other areas where Chinese is ongoing and many of them are environmentally damaging as well as unsustainable for the locals. These are the answers that we can see on how much Chinese investment really cares about the people possibly impacted. 

KM: In contrast, what does Taiwan have to do to truly differentiate itself from China as an investment partner for Southeast Asian countries, for example in the New Southbound Policy we discussed earlier? (Especially considering China’s reputation for “debt trap diplomacy” and its disregard for democracy and human rights.)

EH: Again, I’m not in a position to say what I think Taiwan should do, because as a journalist, I’m not supposed to say my opinion on that. I think what could be different is to respect human rights, the disadvantages that you could cause on the people where you’re investing. If you think about those things when you’re investing in the area, it would actually make you different from China. 

KM: What other challenges do you see Southeast Asia and East Asia facing as a whole on the issue of human rights?

EH: What’s happening is that the human rights violations are still ongoing throughout the region. On top of that, what’s worse is social media and misinformation and disinformation, how the governments these days are using social media to disinform people and distribute propaganda throughout their regions.

When you look at many different Southeast Asian countries, there are very similar issues. The same goes for Myanmar. Social media and misinformation have really led to crimes against humanity over the last two and a half years. It really tells us that this has raised an alarm in the region.

Human rights violations are still ongoing, and on top of that, we are still facing that threat of disinformation on social media, which is so easy to spread. 

(All photos courtesy of the Human Rights Foundation and the 2019 Oslo Freedom Forum in Taiwan)